Questions and answers

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Gutser
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Gutser » Fri Sep 23, 2016 9:56

Actually I´m satisfied with my Conbra M5. Just the yaw axis, the potentiometer is flickering to the left and its getting worse.

So, I´m realy looking forward to the Gunfighter with K12 Grip. Does the Gunfighter will have a good yaw axis?

Sokol1
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Sokol1 » Sat Sep 24, 2016 0:34

Does the Gunfighter will have a good yaw axis?


It's said that are planed a optional KG12 plastic grip with twist rudder with contactless MaRS sensor (same of Gladiator) and ball bearings, for Gladiator PRO and Gunfighter - for extra cost.
To be produced after Gunfighter initial release, expected for next mount.

Gutser
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Gutser » Sat Sep 24, 2016 21:16

Thanks for the answer.

Should I buy the Gunfighter including the basegrip as soon as released and later the KG12-Grip with twist-rudder? Or will it be possible to get the Gunfighterbase (or Gladiator if there is no difference) directly with KG12? What will be the fastest and best way to get the Gunfighter with twist (KG12)?

... and wait, what does this mean, "initial release, expected for next mount" - can we expect the Gunfighter release next month? O.o

o7

Edit: Location is Europe/Germany.

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Re: Questions and answers

Postby hon0 » Sat Sep 24, 2016 21:25

http://www.speedlink.com/?p=2&cat=214&pid=39315&paus=1

2000 value only for X, Y? Or you can boost it with a software?
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Sokol1
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Sokol1 » Sun Sep 25, 2016 3:21

AIRROW limited firmware config software allow select resolution, in increments of 2, between 8 (?) to 12 for X, Y axis, and 8 to 10 for rudder and throttle.

https://s15.postimg.io/wzzfk26az/Airrow.jpg

2000 is ~11 bits... what is not available in their soft options... :?:

Gutser,

It appears that in early in October Gunfighter will be released, but initially without "twist rudder", you will need await a bit more. :)

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Re: Questions and answers

Postby RecklessPrudence » Sun Sep 25, 2016 17:25

Sokol1 wrote:It appears that in early in October Gunfighter will be released, but initially without "twist rudder", you will need await a bit more. :)

What? Dammit. I only just bought a Cobra to serve as a stand-in stick until the Gunfighter came out. Could've saved that money and bought a Gunfighter sooner.

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Eduard VKB FSC
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Eduard VKB FSC » Mon Sep 26, 2016 0:37

RecklessPrudence wrote:I only just bought a Cobra to serve as a stand-in stick until the Gunfighter came out. Could've saved that money and bought a Gunfighter sooner.

Hello,
Well, at the moment the Gunfighter is in final stage of development and almost ready to be prototyped. It is not just a different housing but different gimbal as well which should work under heavier conditions (that is needed to be able to work with full-metal grip and grip extension).

Therefore, looking at the time needed to plan a production run with all needed tests, we do not expect Gunfighter to be released this year. Most likely Q1 next year but it is new product with many changes and improvements. If something goes wrong and testing reveals any issues, it will take time to fix it and it may delay it a little longer.
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RecklessPrudence
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby RecklessPrudence » Mon Sep 26, 2016 2:42

Eduard VKB FSC wrote:
RecklessPrudence wrote:I only just bought a Cobra to serve as a stand-in stick until the Gunfighter came out. Could've saved that money and bought a Gunfighter sooner.

Hello,
Well, at the moment the Gunfighter is in final stage of development and almost ready to be prototyped. It is not just a different housing but different gimbal as well which should work under heavier conditions (that is needed to be able to work with full-metal grip and grip extension).

Therefore, looking at the time needed to plan a production run with all needed tests, we do not expect Gunfighter to be released this year. Most likely Q1 next year but it is new product with many changes and improvements. If something goes wrong and testing reveals any issues, it will take time to fix it and it may delay it a little longer.

Okay, thanks for the info! I'll start saving my pennies - hopefully your jet grip will come out soon after.

Gutser
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Gutser » Tue Sep 27, 2016 15:04

RecklessPrudence wrote:What? Dammit. I only just bought a Cobra to serve as a stand-in stick until the Gunfighter came out. Could've saved that money and bought a Gunfighter sooner.


The Cobra is worth the price. You will not get more precision in this price range. Maybe you must organize a new potentiometer (sadly no standard) but then you have a good stick until Gunfighter with jaw release and after that you have a good one as spare stick ... or to give it to a friend, so that he can feel how it is to fly with good hardware.

Anyway, I still don´t get my question answered. Mainly I want to know, how to buy the Gunfighter with Jaw in the best way? I want to have it as fast as possible and for the best price. I say that because I see following 2 issues:
1. The costs for two orders are much higher (1x delivery and taxes just for gladiator pro are 63,- EUR)
2. Because I don´t want to have this: KG12 release / Gunfighter not availible

So, it would be very helpful to give us the best way, how to order Gunfighter with Jaw/KG12? Should we buy the Gunfighter on release date because you cannot guaranty the availability of the Gunfighter on KG12 release? Do you will provide the Gunfighter base with KG12 stick (1x delivery, taxes on 1 part)? etc. …

It would be very helpfull for us Europe customers to make the best decision.

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Re: Questions and answers

Postby nrage147 » Sat Oct 01, 2016 20:51

Gutser wrote:Actually I´m satisfied with my Conbra M5. Just the yaw axis, the potentiometer is flickering to the left and its getting worse.

Me too, and me too. My yaw has an intermittent fault whereby it no longer centers correctly. I have to add a 20% deadzone to stop it drifting. Then, the fault will go away and I can reduce the deadzone to the 8% (which I use to cancel out minor unintended inputs).

Eduard mentioned a few options here:
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=2200&start=45#p22795

nichiren
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby nichiren » Mon Oct 03, 2016 12:07

Hi, I've been nursing a dilemma of sorts for a little while now.

First of all, I really, really don't want to get pedals and due to this, I've been considering non-Pro as it has the twist axis. But at the same time, I'd also prefer to have more buttons that are accessible without removing the hand from the grip (I play mostly E:D) since the other hand is needed for the throttle. As I've understood, the basic Gladiator has fixed grip making Gladiator Pro sound a lot better considering that a different kind of grip is possibly being planned for later. Of course, without the twist it's just an expensive paperweight regardless of the grip, but I also noticed that there is going to be a twist axis KG12 option/upgrade available for Pro as well so it would probably work at least till a "modern" grip upgrade is available.

I've got a cheap plastic hunk of a junk for HOTAS at the moment, it'll keep me going for some time if necessary so I'm not in an immediate hurry but if at all feasible, a Gladiator Pro with twist KG12 grip would probably be the optimal solution for me until the new style grip makes it (and I'm assuming we're talking months at least before that happens). Of course, if the modern grip will not include the twist axis, I'll end up stuck using the KG12 style whether or not I'll get the Pro or non-Pro one. I'll probably be able to live with it as long as the twist is there.

In short, a few answers would possibly help me decide whether or not I'll get a non-Pro Gladiator (or something else completely) now, or do I suffer the horrendous plastic clunker for a little while longer and get the Pro w/ twist.

1) Is the KG12 twist grip going to be sold solely as an option to newly bought Gladiator Pro, or is it a separate upgrade?
2) Any guesstimations on when it is going to be available?
3) Are all the possible new grip designs going to be compatible with the Gladiator Pro base?
4) Probably way too early for this, so let's call it a bonus question, but are there any plans for the replacement grip(s) for Pro, will a twist axis option be available?

Thanks.

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Eduard VKB FSC
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Eduard VKB FSC » Wed Oct 05, 2016 11:23

nichiren wrote:
1) Is the KG12 twist grip going to be sold solely as an option to newly bought Gladiator Pro, or is it a separate upgrade?
2) Any guesstimations on when it is going to be available?
3) Are all the possible new grip designs going to be compatible with the Gladiator Pro base?
4) Probably way too early for this, so let's call it a bonus question, but are there any plans for the replacement grip(s) for Pro, will a twist axis option be available?


Hello nichiren,
Thanks for the post and your explanation. It is important for us to know the needs of our customers.

Here is my answers:

1-2) It is too early to say how exactly KG12 grip will be sold and what options will be available when KG12 grip is available for purchase.
3) The connector will be changed in next Gladiator Pro version. We hope that it will be the final change but it will be clear only after some time based on experience our customers and our support people get.
4) Yes, VKB R&D is currently busy with a prototype of twist version of Gladiator Pro grip. The results are promising and the twist version of the grip is planned to be produced. The next edition of Gladiator Pro should have a choice of two grips - with and without twist axis. The twist version will be a bit higher (6-8 mm) than non-twist version as extra space is required to mount a ball bearing.

Best regards,
Eduard
VKB store in Europe - http://flightsimcontrols.com

nichiren
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby nichiren » Thu Oct 06, 2016 19:58

Eduard VKB FSC wrote:1-2) It is too early to say how exactly KG12 grip will be sold and what options will be available when KG12 grip is available for purchase.
3) The connector will be changed in next Gladiator Pro version. We hope that it will be the final change but it will be clear only after some time based on experience our customers and our support people get.
4) Yes, VKB R&D is currently busy with a prototype of twist version of Gladiator Pro grip. The results are promising and the twist version of the grip is planned to be produced. The next edition of Gladiator Pro should have a choice of two grips - with and without twist axis. The twist version will be a bit higher (6-8 mm) than non-twist version as extra space is required to mount a ball bearing.


Hi Eduard, thank you for taking the time to answer.

So, if I understood correctly, I'd better wait until the new Gladiator Pro edition is available to ensure I'm able to get the twist grip. Can the next edition be expected to become available before end of this year or is 2017 a more realistic expectation? And I assume it'll just replace the current edition without much fanfare?

Thanks.

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Re: Questions and answers

Postby hon0 » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:34

Good morning.

I would like to know if the GunFighter will benefit from the same "soft area with virtually no resistance" arround the center than the Gladiator have.

Question: When the stick is in the central/neutral position, why does it have a small, but soft area with virtually no resistance? Is this caused by poor design or production?

Answer: No, we did it on purpose.

Our analysis of virtual pilots’ preferences showed that many prefer sticks with a very soft behavior at the center. The strong "engagement step" of other joysticks, which tries to hold the handle in the center spot can prevent accurate aiming when it is needed most. To move the grip a very small amount, it becomes necessary to make an effort to overcome this "step". This center "step" on a joystick axis tells you when you are in the center, but on other hand it prevents precise control in the approximate central position. It is important to have a balance and we have tried to implement such balance by giving priority to the soft behavior in the middle, rather than a clear and hard return to center force, while also using very accurate sensors and solid construction throughout the internals.

Additionally, when you try to eliminate any excess free movement with plastic parts rubbing against each other, you can encounter annoying stickiness causing jumpy behavior. It can cause more problems than it solves. Our design with the softer center eliminates such issues.


As it's what I hate on my extended Warthog.. Must Offset it to get rid of the centering problem..
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Bourrinopathe
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Re: Questions and answers

Postby Bourrinopathe » Fri Oct 14, 2016 16:51

The Gunfighter gimbal should be really close to the Gladiator Pro/Black Mamba MkIII (but slightly different, improved and tougher).
The comment you quoted is for the Gladiator (standard) which has that very specific "floating" center area.

By default the cam-based gimbal has a really soft center with a barely noticeable center "bump" - afaik it's just here so you can feel the neutral position if you need to. With different cams the center can be more noticeable.

Maybe some former Warthog's gimbal users would be able to describe the difference compared to the cam-based gimbal.
Imho, there's no need to worry about struggling with a Gunfighter while playing around the center. Also: ball bearings are everywhere, so you can ditch the word "stickiness".
/// ВКБ Black Mamba MkIII / ВКБ T-Rudder MkII / ВКБ Gladiator / X-55 Rhino throttle / OpenTrack /// UTC +4 ///


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