Questions and answers

[hon0]

Thanks.

Below you can see my actual Joystick.
The extended Gladiator PRO will be very similar in term of angular mouvement. I'm REALLY afraid to go from 16bit to 12 on these axis. Especially on an extended JoyStick made to fly WWII that require extreme accuracy.

[UIV]

Do you really believe that your joystick has a precision of 16 bits?

[hon0]

Do you really believe that your joystick has a precision of 16 bits?

Hello UIV.

According to what I know about my stick and the official specification. Yes
The RAW data in DIVIEW confirm that.

http://www.leobodnar.com/shop/index.php ... page&id=12


Am I all wrong?



Have a good Week End.
Antoine

[Eduard VKB FSC]

Hello Antoine,

12-bit or 16-bit is just a way how a controller deals with the input from sensors. NJoy32 is adjustable and you can set this parameter from 2 bits to 15 bits. We set it by default to 12 bits as this kind of precision is above the ability of human hand to control the stick. You can set it higher if you want. But 12 bits are optimal parameter which provides maximal accuracy without excessive load of controller and its power consumption.

The important is that "bits" are not really important parameter if it is above of certain level. It helps to sell but does not improve the quality. Important is the precision of the sensor and don't forget about ability of gimbal to provide that accuracy.

To have a list of priorities it should look like:

1. precision of sensors (how precise it detects movement of a gimbal)
2. precision of controller (how precise it digitizes the input from sensors)
3. ability of gimbal to provide the accuracy of control which fits with both above

MaRS detects rotaton for 0,02 degrees that's what controller should fit with.

Best regards,
Eduard

[UIV]

Thrustmaster likes to play with numbers They start to use this way when they made their Cougar joystick. Do you remember what precission they wrote for HOTAS Cougar?
12 bits is enough for any joysticks. Human's ability for controlling joystick is limited. You can not control a joystick with an accuracy of 16 bits.

For example:
The angle of the joystick is 45 degrees.
Precision: 16-bit
The height of the joystick: 300 mm (with extension)
One count at 16-bit precision means moving the stick to 0,003mm length!!!

VKB don't like play in this game. To show the very high values of accuracy, we can configure our joysticks with 15 bit precision, but we do not want to lie to our customers. We are not Thrustmaster.
All VKB controllers have a special function - "precision adjustment". You can adjust the precision from 8 bits (256 steps per axis) to 15 bits (32767 steps).
VKB Gladiator joystick is with 15 bits

VKB Gladiator joystick is with 12 bits

16 bits of precision is needed for the gaming steering wheel (angle of rotation bigger than 900 degrees). But not for the joystick with a small angle.

[hon0]

Thanks a LOT for your answers ! I'll definitly buy an Extended Glad pro with your Knupplegriff KG12 replica. As I'm flyin 109 and 190 daily ! ♥

Have a Good Week End Pilot

PS :

3. ability of gimbal to provide the accuracy of control which fits with both above

That's the problem with the warthog system..


Thanks Again

[Spyboy]

Hi Eduard
If you plug the VKB pedals mk 3 or mk 4 into the VKB Gladiator pedals port does that disable the twist grip rudder function.
Waiting for Gladiator and considering pedals
Regards

[Bourrinopathe]

Hi,

I've tested the Gladiator + T-Rudder MkII: the twist axis is still available. You only add a new (pre-configured) axis controlled by the pedals.
I just had to re-calibrate the axes.

[Sokol1]

Hon0

This help understand the 'resolution hype" : http://www.hempstick.org/download/artic ... lution.pdf

[RecklessPrudence]

Hello from Australia! I'm looking at ordering a Defender Cobra M5 in the near future, but I'd really like one with MaRS and NJoy32, like the second generation. At least, until the Gunfighter comes out and I buy that. About how much would those extras cost me, and what would shipping be like? Should I wait until I can order them all at once? Would you guys fit them if I did so, or is it so easy to do so that I can do it blindfolded?

Thanks!

[Eduard VKB FSC]

Hello from Australia! I'm looking at ordering a Defender Cobra M5 in the near future, but I'd really like one with MaRS and NJoy32, like the second generation. At least, until the Gunfighter comes out and I buy that. About how much would those extras cost me, and what would shipping be like? Should I wait until I can order them all at once? Would you guys fit them if I did so, or is it so easy to do so that I can do it blindfolded?

Hello RecklessPrudence !

I would recommend to buy a new Gladiator Pro joystick instead. It is a replacement of King Cobra (modded version of Defender Cobra M5).
They are on the way to our European store and will be on sale next week. Gladiator Pro has all features you mentioned plus metal gimbal. However, I am expecting to have some upgrade kits for Defender Cobra M5 but later, in September most likely.

[nrage147]

Hello from Australia! I'm looking at ordering a Defender Cobra M5 in the near future, but I'd really like one with MaRS and NJoy32, like the second generation. At least, until the Gunfighter comes out and I buy that. About how much would those extras cost me, and what would shipping be like? Should I wait until I can order them all at once? Would you guys fit them if I did so, or is it so easy to do so that I can do it blindfolded?

Hello RecklessPrudence !

I would recommend to buy a new Gladiator Pro joystick instead. It is a replacement of King Cobra (modded version of Defender Cobra M5).
They are on the way to our European store and will be on sale next week. Gladiator Pro has all features you mentioned plus metal gimbal. However, I am expecting to have some upgrade kits for Defender Cobra M5 but later, in September most likely.

Hi Eduard,

I have a Cobra M5 (RevB/3rd edition) and it has a number of "issues":
- Rudder/yaw does not correctly center, it will sit off center by varying amounts depending on direction of return to center.
- Throttle (not that I use it) does not hit maximum value every time.
- X/Y also do not always hit maximum value.

I've done a bunch of calibration and I have quite a large deadzone on the yaw (currently) to deal with the issues. Would an upgrade to the MaRS and NJoy32 resolve any (all?) of those issues?

If so, I would be very interested in those upgrade kits (when available in September) but it would depend a little on cost/shipping and whether it's easy enough (for someone who is no stranger to assembling PCs etc) to fit the kit myself.

Does the metal gimbal upgrade for the M5 still exist? Is this something we can install ourselves? Does this remove/replace the twist yaw? (I don't have pedals at this stage).

I really like the sound of the Gladiator, however it simply doesn't have enough buttons for me. I really love how the M5 has a mode selector on the stick in a position where it can be reached without taking your hands off the stick. For me the M5 has the absolute minimum number of physical hats and buttons, the fact that the mode selector expands this is icing on the cake.

Thanks!

[RecklessPrudence]

Hello from Australia! I'm looking at ordering a Defender Cobra M5 in the near future, but I'd really like one with MaRS and NJoy32, like the second generation. At least, until the Gunfighter comes out and I buy that. About how much would those extras cost me, and what would shipping be like? Should I wait until I can order them all at once? Would you guys fit them if I did so, or is it so easy to do so that I can do it blindfolded?

Hello RecklessPrudence !

I would recommend to buy a new Gladiator Pro joystick instead. It is a replacement of King Cobra (modded version of Defender Cobra M5).
They are on the way to our European store and will be on sale next week. Gladiator Pro has all features you mentioned plus metal gimbal. However, I am expecting to have some upgrade kits for Defender Cobra M5 but later, in September most likely.

The Gladiator Pro does look good, but I've got a HOTAS setup that I'm replacing the joystick for, so I'm holding out for the Gunfighter. Plus I'm one of those that wants a million buttons, so even once the Gunfighter comes out, I'll probably be waiting for the jet fighter grip I heard you guys are doing, based on the Su-35, right? The M5 is for in the meantime, since my current joystick has died entirely. But while I'm waiting, I'd still like the kind of precision that those upgrades give me, so I'm hoping to grab them at the same time. Just would like to know how much extra I'll need to budget for.

Unless, of course, you say that the Gunfighter and jet grip's ETA is sufficiently soon after September that I would be wasting my money, in which case I'll just pick up the base M5 to tide me over, and get the thing I really want as soon as it comes out.

EDIT: Although if the upgrades are expensive enough - they are most of the cost of going from a Gladiator to a Gladiator Pro, after all, so it'd be understandable! - I might just grab the M5 and put the money that would have gone into upgrading it aside, in preparation for the Gunfighter.

[nrage147]

Hon0

This help understand the 'resolution hype" : http://www.hempstick.org/download/artic ... lution.pdf

Any idea where I can get the JoyResTest.exe it mentions in there?

[Bourrinopathe]

I didn't find that software either. Only references on several forums, so maybe some users still use it.

You can use the VKB JoyTester to get the resolution info (from any connected device).



As you can see, there's no "resolution" "n-bit" value here, but all you have to do is:
- select your device
- gently move the axis until you get a first consistent "step" value
- and then: 65536/step value = resolution (number of values per axis)

In my picture (VKB Black Mamba, set to 12-bit resolution): 65536/16 = 4096

8-bit = 256
9-bit = 512
10-bit = 1024
11-bit = 2048
12-bit = 4096
13-bit = 8192
14-bit = 16384
15-bit = 32768
16-bit = 65536 (step=1)

If the step value suddenly jumps to 1, just restart the process.

At least, that's how I use it