Kosmosima twist resistance

[kosta]

Hello,
can it be changed, weakened? I am finding it quite hard to break middle, and it's nowhere near what I'd call smooth.

[AeroGator]

If you feel the twist is anything but buttery smooth, please start with opening a ticket with the dealer's.
If there is any problem of mechanical nature it is the dealer who should handle the case. Yours is the first complaint about twist movement, so I believe there may be some mech fault.

[redlir]

Oh he's not alone. I opened a ticket for my original left handle I ordered and was told to basically wait until the grease breaks in. I have since purchased 2 other full kits, so I now own 2 left and 1 right handles. They all have the same problem. I'm actually on these forums today looking for a way to take apart the twist so a different spring can be swapped out and I ran into this thread.

There is so much resistance pushing down, you can't reasonably twist the stick with a micro movement like you can on a T16/Delta etc. If you lightly pull up on the handle while twisting, you can feel this pressure lessen and it's a little easier to twist.

What I would like to know is if this part is user serviceable so

1) It can be regreased
2) An alternate spring can be placed in there. If so, what part number is the existing spring and what part number is the "light" spring that was used in the beta testing?

[AeroGator]

@kosta
@redlir
Please take a picture of how the grips are mounted - particularly the rusk part - and post it here.
NO external file hosting (i.e., imgur, google drive, etc.) - just upload it here.
This was numero uno.
Numero dos, you can disassemble the twist mechanism, wash out extra viscous lube that we put there, and replace it with any silicone lube for plastic parts.
Just in case let me repeat: only lubrication clearly marked as for plastic parts will do.
Numero tres, you can also replace the spring. We don't offer replacement springs, but a raid over a friendly car garage or whatever mechanical workshop may be a solution.

@redlir, I believe there is something in what the dealer asked you to do (let the plastic parts get worked to each other). You have three grips, and you understand how incredibly low are the chances of all three being defective. Besides, left and right twists are different, so...

[kosta]

Hello,
I already sent my grip to FSC for exchange.
I'll take pictures after I receive the replacement.

[redlir]

I've been through the picture route with your engineers, I'm good on that front.

Let me clarify my previous post. I'm not claiming all 3 sticks are faulty, I just believe at this point it's the design of them, and the strength of the spring that was chosen after beta, keeps it a bit to firmly on the center bump for some users. A lot of folks will be coming from a T16000 or awkward Delta for a long awaited left replacement. I can appreciate the design makes it so the twist mechanism doesn't inadvertently move, but in my case, this is not completely ideal for my usage, as it prevents small accurate movements on center. I think my first handle may have been a 'little' under-greased compared to the last 2, but it's clear from having all 3 in hand, they all behave generally the same way. I'll let Kosta explain his situation and won't speak for his device of course.

Regarding NUMERO DOS: Are there instructions somewhere from VKB on how this can be serviced properly. I don't mind doing it ( I have good grease for plastic already) but I don't want to damage anything.
Regarding NUMERO TRES: I can source my own part, but it would be easier if I knew what the baseline part is in the device already. So I can search for something of the same size/type but less tension.

Thank you!

[rtrski]

Disclaimer: I like the way twist works on my LH Kosmo, but I'm using it as a 'relative' axis (x4, square profile even). I also have not attempted disassembly of the twist to see how the little bump is designed, that you have to lift off of as you twist either way. (Or it's the other way around and one part has a notch that it drops into on center...

Second disclaimer: What I'm about to suggest probably constitutes warranty-ending action!!!

Idea: I wonder if you could perhaps mildly sand either a lip profile or a protruding bump that is creating the center detente, to get the breaking / releasing force closer to what you want? Basically redoing the plastic 'cam' a little bit for yourself...?

Third disclaimer: Please re-read Second Disclaimer!

[nyvn]

I agree that the centering/detent is stronger than I'd prefer.

Current Spring size and tension would be a good information to have, I also second the need for instructions to make this adjustment.

[kosta]

I received the replacement stick, and it's same as the first one, with a single difference - the "new" one now makes weird spring-noises when turned - louder when left, softer when right.
I don't even know if I should go for another exchange

Having the high quality all-metal gimbal on the base, and now having a plastic twist... somehow doesn't make the picture whole.

[fallout9]

weird spring-noises when turned - louder when left, softer when right.

Make sure the 2 washers holding the grip attached to the base are all screwed in and not sticking out.

[kosta]

Yes, the washers are as tight as they ever were with the stock grip. Firm finger twist... and they are definitely all the way in.

[AeroGator]

I can source my own part, but it would be easier if I knew what the baseline part is in the device already. So I can search for something of the same size/type but less tension.

A warning correction from the engineers:
It is not just the external and internal diameter of the spring that matters.
It is also the diameter of the steel wire it is made of, as well as the number of coils (because this determines the total travel of the whole thing; if, say, you have 5 turns of 3 mm wire it will give you a 15 mm limit when fully compressed, but if you replace it with the spring of 4 turns, same thickness - you will only have a 12 mm limit, and it can lead to your device jamming or jumping out of its seat, or whatever).
So the engineers said while my numero tres advice is still valid, it is a game of trying and erring, and it may take forever to find a right choice. Our springs were made to order, so finding a replacement would be a challenge.
Sorry for giving a misleading advice.

Talking different lubes, you are safe with any plastic-safe lube. We were even considering providing a tiny plastic sealed pipette with a different lube with every retailed kit but nowadays airlines are quite picky about anything liquid or jelly, so we had to drop this plan.

[AeroGator]

I agree that the centering/detent is stronger than I'd prefer.
Current Spring size and tension would be a good information to have, I also second the need for instructions to make this adjustment.

I addressed the spring size issue in another reply posted a few mins ago, please read.

[redlir]

I can source my own part, but it would be easier if I knew what the baseline part is in the device already. So I can search for something of the same size/type but less tension.

A warning correction from the engineers:
It is not just the external and internal diameter of the spring that matters.
It is also the diameter of the steel wire it is made of, as well as the number of coils (because this determines the total travel of the whole thing; if, say, you have 5 turns of 3 mm wire it will give you a 15 mm limit when fully compressed, but if you replace it with the spring of 4 turns, same thickness - you will only have a 12 mm limit, and it can lead to your device jamming or jumping out of its seat, or whatever).
So the engineers said while my numero tres advice is still valid, it is a game of trying and erring, and it may take forever to find a right choice. Our springs were made to order, so finding a replacement would be a challenge.
Sorry for giving a misleading advice.

Talking different lubes, you are safe with any plastic-safe lube. We were even considering providing a tiny plastic sealed pipette with a different lube with every retailed kit but nowadays airlines are quite picky about anything liquid or jelly, so we had to drop this plan.

Right so... is is possible to get these measurements of the medium and even the light springs you guys had made ( for beta). It at least gives us a starting point on the search.

[nyvn]

I agree that the centering/detent is stronger than I'd prefer.
Current Spring size and tension would be a good information to have, I also second the need for instructions to make this adjustment.

I addressed the spring size issue in another reply posted a few mins ago, please read.

Would it be possible to get some instructions regarding the best way to open this part of the grip?