[SOLVED] Poblem with Gunfighter x-axis

[UIV]

Please, make the screenshots for both axes (X and Y) separately.

[tecman69]

OK, in an attempt to put everything back to the original settings before the changes instructed by Ron61, I hit the "Default" button and a dialogue came up saying something like, "Do you want to put the box back to default setting". I clicked OK and the Black Box went dark. After rebooting, all LEDs blink on the box but then go dark and the two normal lights never come back on.

I completely shutdown and un-plugged and re-plugged the Black Box to make sure capacitors drained. On boot, all 4 lights blink and then the 2 normal LEDs (Stick & Bus) come on until the login screen comes up and then go dark. On running VKBDevCfg as administrator, I can no longer see the Black Box in the window.

Do you have any suggestions to bring it back online?

[UIV]

Connect BlackBox to USB and run show_hid
http://ftp.vkb-sim.pro/Programms/show_hid.rar
And post a screenshot from show_hid here.

[tecman69]

Please, make the screenshots for both axes (X and Y) separately.

OK, I've got the box online again and back to default settings MPL = 10.

Here is the JoyTester y-axis graph:

and x-axis:

Physically, the dry-clutches have been completely loosened including the center bolt on each nylon clutch.

[UIV]

Are you sure, did you unscrew this M3 screw?

[tecman69]

Absolutely UIV, the nylon pieces are hanging loose and I have only put one turn on each spring-loaded nut, just enough to keep them in place. I am convinced it is not the dry-clutch causing the problem with the x-axis.

[UIV]

Compare the oscillation of Y and X axes.
X axis returned to the center immediately. But Y axis with ocillations. What is blocking the X-axis?

[UIV]

Which cam and which springs are mounted on the X axis?
Move the grip to left side and release. How many oscillations grip made?

[tecman69]

Default cam and default spring on both axes. Your last question is what I have been testing for 5 days. What is causing the friction in the x-axis. The only conclusion I have come up with is something in the rod/bearing interface on that axis.

I was hoping that breaking the stick in would loosen it up, and I have flown for many hours with it without much improvement. I am pretty good from the technical/engineering side. I have done basic disassembly/reassembly several times using different springs/cams/clutch-settings. But these last graphs are with everything back to as-shipped.

If you want me to troubleshoot to a greater depth by breaking it down further in order to prevent just return shipping it, I would be glad to. Just tell me what you want me to do mechanically and I will dig deeper. I just want clearance from VKB should things go downhill and I return pieces instead of just a defective stick

Either way, I want to end up with a good working stick, not a refund, as this is the best I've ever used, even in this less than perfect condition.

[rrohde]

It seems as if the X axis is still affected by the dry clutch; you can clearly see the difference between the X and Y axes oscillating in your screenshots. Because of that, the X axis doesn't seem to return to center because it is being slowed down to get there.

There are two screws that make up the dry clutch construction, the vertical copper nut, and the other screw that clenches both halves of the clutch together. Both screws should be loosened to release force the clutch has on the axis.

Once the screws have been fully loosened, the Gunfighter has to be re-calibrated again to allow the MaRS sensor to get the new centering data. WIthout any damper affecting the X axis, the stick has no choice as to return to the center (you can also experiment with stiffer springs or put 2x springs per axis if you'd like).

Feel free to contact me directly (so I can give you my phone number) to go over this. It's really worth getting this right.

EDIT: Sniped me.

[tecman69]

Yup Rainer, did all that. I even thought about completely removing the nylon pieces to totally remove any chance that the clutch is involved, and that would be my next move on the mechanical testing side. If you and UIV think I should try this, let me know. I just wanted the OK from VKB before going this far in the break-down should I not be able to get things completely back together for return.

Like I said, I am a pretty good engineer so I don't think that would happen, its just CYA :)

[tecman69]

Also, I can rule out a calibration problem, because I can definitely feel resistance in the x-axis throw vs. the y-axis. Pitch feels perfect, but I can feel a low-level physical resistance in yaw. Just give me the go-ahead and I will completely take the nylon clutch off.

[rrohde]

Also, when checking for oscillation as asked for by UIV - please put the grip back so you have the leverage needed to move the X axis to one side fully and then let go. Then see how it behaves.

[rrohde]

And - another idea: Remove the clutch fully from the X axis by removing the L-shaped PCB (remove the two small screws holding it in place), pull off the PCB, remove the M3 nut holding the clutch halves together, pull out the clutch, and then don't assemble anything, just put the grip on, and test how the X axis behaves. It should be free of any friction without the clutch being there.

[rrohde]

Sniped again.

Yes, you have permission to pull off the clutch!